Horse Racing Fantasy Community

i agree with you observation

How? In quickstart there is still luck of the draw in the races that we play. Give us some tips so at least the playing field is even. heheh and we can win some points.

UBUNTU!!!

i dont enter jockey tourns because i dont like them but seeing some of these pps is hard to believe.

I can't speak for the "top" jockeys mentioned here. But as a new player I have been wondering myself.

Playing in the lower ranks there are several players that have been playing for many months with thousands of races. Yet they maintain a low enough tourney PPS to enter low level tournies. Then you get smoked by someone who posts PPS score 2-3 times higher than you and their rateing. I can see that on occassion. But how do they do it and win over and over without raising their PPS.

Not mentioning names, but some of these folks are really playing below their class. They may be winning several tournies a day, but I have less and less respect for them as time goes by.

Sorry just venting. Again, this is NOT directed at the folks above, that are so obviously at the top of the "Jockey - Food Chain" =)
================================
♪♪ Bad Boyz - Bad Boyz, What'cha going to do?
What'cha going to do when they come for you ♪♪

Qwerty---did u used to play backgammon on Yahoo or gamesgrid?
Bit unfair to make this point on this Tourney--5 pointer--just takes 1 outsider. Wrubinski's not seen before. Lele not in top 3.

Qwerty--seen your pps history--can see not use quick start before became non-community--i had same prob to start with. but check out my pps history, week by week, tourney and non-tourney. 250-400 as weekly pps is perfectly possible. As not going to always win or get placed, need higher pps on occasions to achieve that.
My advice is more likely in Allowance more than 1 mile, possible in un...., unlikely in grade 1,2 & 3 and impossible almost in 5- 6.5 furlongs

I agree that is a high pps. You know sometimes people will hit on that long shot but to do it time and time again. I can't but then sometimes you ride the 2 to 1 (at least I will) because ya know daisy cutter gonna come home 12 lengths ahead.

Please vote for me.

http://www.horseracegame.com/community/forum/topic/125231/im-campaign-ch...

I'd like to have the top 3 PPS at every "distance" (3-5-10-25 races), and have this as a sticky thread (if possible)...

*** 3 races ***
1) "emilyroberts" 1112
2) "emilyroberts" 997
3) "micmac" 992

*** 5 races ***
1) "emilyroberts" 1063
2) "limexpensivetoys" 999
3) "skillet07" 859

*** 10 races ***
1) "limexpensivetoys" 788
2) "lele77" 714
3) "lele77" 626

look who's on the list of record holders of the PPS in different tournament set up... same person and they do this high PPS in consistent basis and in all of their tournament that their into. before its always limexpensive toys who's getting all the high PPS in all his tournaments that he join but i guess the admin found something about his game play and since then he stop joining tournaments and also stop playing this game look into his account.

NOBODY has ever gotten over 1000 avg PPS in the last 2 months.

"emilyroberts" got it 3 times in less than week.

I have avg PPS of around 400, and I can enter A MAXIMUM of 2 tourneys per day.

I am STRONG, she/he is TOO STRONG, also for me. The difference is that she/he hacks up in many tournaments every day, because of her/his low tourney PPS.

I am accused of cheating and insulted in PVT, also REMOVED from a chart by a person without any proofs because I won 2 heat of his world tournament (with a great result, but not a world record).

I agree I should be investigated (I have no problems with it), because I AM STRONG, but don't use me as a scapegoat, because the scapegoat should not be ME.

(sorry for my english)

Yeah, those 1000 + pps averages for 3 and 5 race tourneys is quite impressive. It's equivalent to winning every race with a 16-1 or higher.

i think they ride the bigger odd horse and win at least 5 run with odd 10 above. always maintain

As this says..

**
Yeah, those 1000 + pps averages for 3 and 5 race tourneys is quite impressive. It's equivalent to winning every race with a 16-1 or higher.
**

To get 1000+ pps, you have to win EVERY race, on horses averaging about 20 to 1.
I cant really see how that is do-able, without packet sniffing and hacking packets.

It also looks sus, when you look at the points they have earned, it seems as though they register to 5-10 tournies at once. and then the next day, play all 5-10 tournies with the same few races. usually winning all 5-10 tournies at once.

With them being non vip, there is very very few jockey points being posted to their score as well. It doesnt take many good races to get 1000 points.
They must be throwing a lot of races though, to keep the pps down to what they have.

I think i'll skip the tournies for a while, until the system is reworked.

Regards.

just a thought--too bad we couldn't cheat--and disguise MAN O' WAR!!-BIG CY-OR SEC--and race them in there,huh/??...lol...
BILL.~~;)

I keep away from any human controlled racing...too many ways people figure out to cheat.....atleast the trainer part of it , is non human controlled or there would be cheating there too...

Well hopefully nobody is cheating. The administrators worked so hard to try to avoid cheating. I just don't understand how they get these scores but if they are really that good then I commend them

UBUNTU!!!

What ever is going on, it's costing HRF developers money in the long run. Either thru reduced entries or loss of players to the game.

I just had a look thru the tourney boards to see what ones I am eligible to join. Mind you, I have only played for about 10 days, but everyone I can join, has one or more of these above mentioned players in it. Heck some that I "CAN'T" join have them entered lol.

Needless to say I'll save my 500 community points and go back to playing "WOW" for awhile. No reason to enter a tourney where the high 1-2 scores are going to be "WAY" over my ability.

=================================
♪♪ Bad Boyz - Bad Boyz, What'cha going to do?
What'cha going to do when they come for you ♪♪

I haven't been here that long.. but Ive now noticed the same results now that you mention it.. :(

he/she emilyroberts won again the world jockey championship heat 5 tournament with a 565 PPS is there someone could win this tournament????? lols

In my view, there is nothing wrong with the top pps players producing the top results, subject to 2 criteria:
1) those results are produced in the proper and correct manner.
2) Their weekly/monthly pps is reflective of the results that they produce in tournaments, which only results in them being able to enter the highest rated pps tourneys. This allows the slightly lower rated racers a fair shot at winning tourneys which the highest rated racers can't enter.
Indeed, this should be reflective of REAL racing whereby a jockey is obligated to always ride a horse to its best in each and every race, no matter where they are in the field.
As an example--always last is the first pps tourney i have found, that i can enter other than my own tourneys.

If you check a players best jockey results these may show you on which horses an individual has scored their highest pps and what that pps was. Don't take mine as an example as they are excessively high and were achieved prior to tourneys when 66-1 and 99-1 shots used to be in the field.
It only takes 1 score on an outsider to ramp up the pps. To score 5,300 points in 5 races is certainly unusual, but by no means impossible.
Syrinx--you're top 5 best jockey results range from 1,550 to 3,000. Just one win with colour of money paying 2000 , and no other places would have put you 3rd in the tourney.

where is emilyrobert. may be we can ask how could he/her get that higher pps. I don't want to deny my 500 points if i know i became a looser..hehe

they are gone quite after this issue come up before their always have a say on something especially about their innings in the tournaments now that their being accused of cheating they cant even bother to explain their side lols

Tournaments have been reduced to 200 community points (entry) to alleviate any interim jockey results and clear up speculation/suspicious results. This issue will no doubt be resolved after investigation is complete.

I totally agree with what you describe. I cant see how it's possible for anyone else to win except those that have "the knack" or maybe" a trick up their sleeve".

This will drive those of us who consistently try very hard and fail, away from the tourneys.

Russell

Micmac -

Just curious how does reducing the entry to 200 points change anything? Part of the problem as I see it, is you can enter as many tourneys at one time as you have the points for. Emily and other top players obviously have the points to enter ANY and EVERY tourney. Lowering the fee may mean less prizes per race, but when you can play in 10 at same time and smoke everyone you still get all the points.

Maybe they need to "limit" the number of tourneys you can enter and run in, that overlap. Then perhaps there would be events for us "mere mortals" to race in, without always seeing the "BIG GUNS".

=) BTW is Emily for real or just a "bot". LOL

================================
♪♪ Bad Boyz - Bad Boyz, What'cha going to do?
What'cha going to do when they come for you ♪♪

I'm glad someone brought this up, I was thinking the same thing.

I brought up this subject with someone does care. Maybe we will see some equity....someday.

Russell

Yep. What is it with the overlapping races anyway. How can it be a separate tournament if the results are shared with more than one. This makes no sense.

I was shocked when I found that my very first result was then clones to my second tourney. This is the equivalent of a student taking his/her important exam and getting a "D" - then that "D" being the same for his/her next test before they even take it.

Russell

I see syrinx_07 posted my 5 race 859 average further up in the post. Pretty impressive huh? I wonder if syrinx and I are related? You know, same last name and all (07).

By the way, I'd be happy to share some of my perfectly legal strategies.

Hi - Skillet07

Being new to the game, I would be more than happy to read any strategy you would like to share. As would several others I am sure.

I am trying really hard to improve and willing to listen and learn.

================================
♪♪ Bad Boyz - Bad Boyz, What'cha going to do?
What'cha going to do when they come for you ♪♪

I'll get back on that shortly. I'm watching HBO fights, race at Kentucky speedway, and racing tournys all at the same time right now. haha

wow this is issue just doesnt stop. Eversince it has been a problem of the community when people do better than expected. I know there are ways of being a better jockey by going through the horse records. People may also have found horses that they can always win with like sure bet and nine eyed nancy. I personally do very well with them. I see emily roberts join other tournaments and get really low scores. somewhat at the low 200 pps. I was shocked that she can still join tournamnets with a maximum of 290 as a pps she can defnitely smoke the competition there. This is just an observation not a accusation. I would defnitely want to get some tips from the experienced jockeys. Hopefully someone can help me out also. This game has been great and i have more than 5000 races to my name. It kills the confidence of people at times when you see scores that are way over what yo usually get. I know the administrators are doing everything to level the playing field. There are just a lot of inconsistencies from players that when the pot money is bigger then they just dominate but if its a smaller tournament they go way down on average. Again if you are a very good jockey hope you help the community by telling us how you do it. I mean what could you lose it will just make the tournaments more exciting and this would calm the community down. Well hopefully people would just also respect the game to its fullest so we can all enjoy all of its components.

UBUNTU!!!

Not sure about you guys, but i have been following threads and keeping quiet as things unfold. I did however greatly respect the comments of alwayslast after his well organised tournament (World Championship Jockey Tournament) After an online altercation resulted, I noticed a post that was quickly deleted (very swiftly) for good reason. In my opinion resulting from this alwayslast had stumbled on a "top player" cheating. All evidence appears to be unfolding and making sense to me.

Reggae Racer is right, and i agree that if you run in 3 or 5 race tourneys are more easier to get high scores (only takes one longshot) and multiple tournaments can be run simultaneously right? Lets take the following example;

1st race winner in all cases is 42/1 or 2500pps approx. EVERY other result 400pps.
*3 races 1100pps (2500+400+400pps = 1100pps avg)
*5 races 820pps (2500+400+400+400+400pps = 820pps avg)
*10 races 610pps (2500/400/400/400/400/400/400/400/400/400pps = 610pps avg)

Which result is harder to achieve???????
Interesting conclusion I make;
Easier to get 1100pps in 3 race tournament than 610pps in 10 race tournament.

There are ways to improve your chances in tournaments, no doubt about it. Im sure it will all be exposed whether or not behind closed doors.

I noticed "someone" is curiously not registered for heat 7, nor the final ?????? Under the Radar??????Wouldnt surprise me if "someone" registers after reading this post. Otherwise is already suspended.

Hi everyone,
Before i start my english is not that good (2nd language)
This is my first post ever and I would like to come forword and clear with you all...
About the cheat!! I'm not sure if you call this is cheat but for me, I still have to try hard to win as you all guys did. I know that is not easy...as I am a 100% women with 2 kids and there is nothing to do with anyone else as I had rides all those racing myself.

1) I used to be a VIP but not recently.
2) My tourneys PPS is 254.953

3) Races 1,512

4) 100 times tournaments winner(just recently winning)
>> All the tournaments I have enter before more than 10 per day << out of that only 10 times winner. Sometimes, the winner always the same person.
>> Yes, thats hurt me a lots but I dont give up and and bother asking them how?.( just keep trying)

5) And recently after always losing, I have try new tactic:
* I ran races after races while not in tournament to get long shot with a very big odds (that I think I can win but not for sure).
* Then when all the tournaments I have enter come together and ready to race (etc.10 tourneys together) I ran the race that I choose it.(but that is not a 100% will win sometime I lose).

6) If I win that first race, I have chance to win the (3, 5 races) but not the 10 races because the pps comes down over more races. And also sometime if my lucks came, I will get another big odds in between.(very very rare)> if did, I screaming happy.
This the horses that I have ride:

Rattlesnake SANTA ANITA 2444
Val Helsing FORT ERIE 2366
Chelsea Dream LAUREL 2356
Zenyatta RIVER DOWNS 2092
Wonderment CHURCHILL DOWNS 2068

7) I still can enter the lower pps tourneys because I only winning recently and used to be a loser. So my tourneys PPS still low.

8) But after all this winning *sometimes (make me so happy because I am women and still can join the result with you guys) >> dont realise all my hard time give myself trouble and probably this is my last day.

9)Come to all of this, I believe I cant please everyone ( someone will not happy). >> the only way to please you guys by drop my pps in tourneys!! then, how about me??

10) I didnt answer your question before because I know this will be a lots more questions and never going to be ended.

11) World records for 3 and 5 races but not in top 5 in 10 races.

Note: just wondering why, when I win everyone keep asking and angered at me/hate me and when I came 19th place with only 80pps. No one bothering ask me?

To: Lele and Syrinx,
Look guys, I am is SHE. (Micmac - there is nothing to do with me at all). I try so hard to come this far. Stop calling me he/she. I know, I cant proof you guys in this but I am 100% sure. Trust me..
I know by bring up my name on the forum can cover up your own issues. Pls guys, I love this game too.

If, I am a cheater in another way I will win those VIP tourney (25 races) with 150,000 prizes which is you Lele the winner.

Regards,
EmilyRoberts

Hello Emily !!!.

Your English is pretty good. So don't worry there.
Your first post? Then welcome to the community.!! You should try to post a bit more :) your English is ok, and you get 10 free points for posting, and get to know everyone.

I don't speak for other people. But for me, I don't think anyone was not happy with you.

Its just a matter that with online games, its very easy to cheat (for a lot of programmers). You basically just alter the information packets that are sent between your computer and the game server. So with all online games, its always a matter of making sure people don't do it, and arent doing it, and having some form of checking so you can find out when people are doing it.

If i understand you right...
You are running races until you find one that has a long odd's roughie in it, that has a chance of winning.
Then you leave the game open, and the race open, until the tournaments have all started.
You enter multiple tournaments and stack them up, until you have 5-10 tournies stacked up.

Then you run the race that you selected that you think a long odd's roughie has a chance of winning.
It might win, it might not, if it does win, it sets you up for a good score in small 3-5 race tourneys.

Quite smart. !!

I don't really see that as cheating. And i dont have a problem with you doing that (personally, I dont speak for others).
I think the rules just say, dont try to skip races during a tournament. I dont think the rules say anything about finding a race you like, as your starting race, before the tournament starts.. To me it just shows dedication, I personally couldn't be bothered going to that much effort. Even if i did, theres still no guarantee that horse will win.

In my opinion (And its just that, my opinion, nothing more, nothing less, and yes even australians are alowed a opinion) :)

To members...
To limit you losing tournaments to freaky high PPS "winners" its best to stick to 10 race tourneys, so scores average out more. And most wins (instead of highest pps) are a good safe guard as well.

To Emily
Dont stress girl, Welcome, dont talk about quitting, :( you are obviously having fun, dedicated, and love the game, don't leave over a forum post or two !!.. If you are doing anything wrong, the game admins will tell you.. Until then have fun.

To The Game Admins
It might be a suggestions to.
1. The first tourney race, is one that is STARTED, AFTER the tournament starts. Any race that was started before the tournament has started, doesn't count towards the tournament.

2. To safe guard your "community points" you have a limit on PPS that can be earned by a player per race of 500.
Maybe this could be the same in tournaments, where the highest points you can earn in a tourney per race is 500. It would limit the 2500 points per race long shots. If you play this game enough, and study it, im sure you would find some long shots in it, that always have a good chance of winning. (more than others)

Anyway, thats just my opinion..
No hard feelings to emily, admins, members..
The game goes on.

And the admins will probably come up with a fairer system soon, They are always improving this game from what ive seen and read.

Regards. :)
Have fun.

Hey i feel yr pain,but come on.motron takes a back seat to no one!

Quit complaning and learn to be a better handicapper
i just started and i can compete with these suckers
Take a deep BREATH and be the jockey u know u can be

yr all a bunch of wining babies
I'll beat u even if yr cheating.Ineed some competition

Welcome Emily -

Thanks for shareing with us. I feel pretty much the same way as Tan, with one exception.

Only thing I have an issue with, if what Tan says is correct, is the setting up of the first race with a high odds favorite. I wasn't aware you could do that. I like many others probably assumed that your first race was AFTER the tourneys started and in the "Blind" so to speak.

To me, setting up the first race is an exploit, and circumvents the concept of fair play. Maybe the developers will correct the issue by taking Tan's suggestion and setting up the program so that the first race has to be "drawn in Quick play" AFTER the start of the tourney.

As Tan mentioned, on line games always have folks playing angles and "gameing the system". It's something the programers constantly deal with. The internet version of a "Nuclear Arms Race".

Again thanks for coming forward and posting your reply. Please stick around and continue to post from time to time.

=================================
♪♪ Bad Boyz - Bad Boyz, What'cha going to do?
What'cha going to do when they come for you ♪♪

Yes they have to get this glitch fixed.
i have often thought about finding a good longshot n sitting on it for a day.Racking up those tourneys.
But then i realized i want to play!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
My skills are better than a trick!
Bring it on cheaters,i ride the WHITE STALLION!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No no,, malicuss mate. I agree with you above :)

Ive just been a "gamer" since the internet came out, I run multiple gaming communities, clan's etc and have been doing so for over a decade. So i'm probably a little bit de-sensitized to exploits and hacks and cheats etc, because most online games have them from time to time. As you said, its a bit like a nuclear arms race :)

Yes it is what's called a exploit, its using a game mechanic to gain a advantage in a way that wasn't intended by the game developers.
And as they pop up, they need fixing and tweaking by the game developer.

But to me, exploiting, isn't cheating. Hacking and altering packets is cheating, exploiting isn't.
To me, exploiting is just playing the game how it was made!.
The fact that it is not how it was intended to be played, is IMO the developers fault. Its not the players fault the game has a bug. :)
(No insult intended to the developers) :)

Of course that's just from a gamers point of view, from a developers point of view, finding and exploiting a bug is probably a deadly sin. lol.

To me, the only thing Emily did wrong, is she did it too often to make it obvious, and she told everyone how she did it. lol...
Yeah yeah ok, so its not the most honest of philosophies. Its the competitive streak in me, I play to win.
But still i never cheat, but to me exploits are the developers fault, not the players.

Being VIP for example, gives you special form guides and more information, and a advantage over non vip members.
This for example, is a advantage i have over Emily, who isn't a VIP at the moment.
If i spent 12 hours a day playing this game, and spend 30 mins studying form before each race, compared to other players that play 1 hour a day and study form for 1 minutes before a race. IS that fair?
Pumping $100's of dollars into buying trainer horses, and picking the best 1-2, compared to people who cant afford to put a lot of $$'s into the game. Is that fair?
People who spam thread with useless crap posts, just to gain 10 points, is that fair?

There's lots of angles to look at things from. I don't have a problem with exploits, but a lot of players do, and in the end, its up to the developers to fix their game, so nothing can be exploited.

I also don't believe in punishing players who find and exploit a bug, because they were just playing the game as it was made. I think its better if things are resolved with the game being patched and fixed. That way you get to keep dedicated devoted players/members, who will probably continue to add to the community for a long time.

Regards.

Sorry if i'm posting too much, these are obviously just my own opinions, and i'm just a newbie here, lol :)

An easy quick fix, might be if the time of the race is recorded when the "quick start"button is pressed. Instead of when the race is run and finishes.

This would stop people pressing the quick start button hours before the tournaments start. And stopping and leaving it on a race they like, that has their favorite rough horse in it.

This way if the race was started and finished after the tourneys started, it would be recorded as the time the quick start button was pressed (before the tournament was started)

Regards..

for gaiwaterhouse :

I created that DELETED NOW thread to show everyone the accuses that "alwayslast" was sending to me by PMs, and I asked Puddles to check all mine, and other's users best results, and giving all my points to "alwayslast" if I was guilty, but to punish him if I wasn't.

The thread was deleted, and I stopped updating my CHART and my WORLD PPS RECORDS, because I felt not tutelated being not guilty until proven (and it won't be proven, because I am not guilty).

Then, about tournaments, I'll just participate my own tournaments, so if anyone wants to compete with me he can enter, unless, he/she won't find me in other's tournaments.

(sorry for my english)

Can't we all just get along?

Motron,

We could just get along and never say a word to anyone about feeling cheated by a game's inadequacies in a particular area. I think that is what this thread is about.

Those that win all the time are probably playing within the game's intended parameters. When the gamer starts feeling like fodder for the top guns, then it ceases being fun.

Russell

Motron.

There's hardly any bickering in here, its mainly a simple discussion on a game mechanic. With a lot of suggestions on how to fix and improve it. So the game is better and fairer.

What bickering there has been in this thread, its almost all from you.

Quoted from motron above.

***
motron takes a back seat to no one!
Quit complaning and learn to be a better handicapper
i just started and i can compete with these suckers
yr all a bunch of wining babies
I'll beat u even if yr cheating.
Ineed some competition
***

You insulted people. No-one else did.
And you did it with spam, 3 pointless posts in a row.

Have you even read this thread? Or read the forum rules?

I'll quote them for you below just in case..

1. No profanity whasoever. (Remember that our boards are open to users of various ages. We understand that at certain times, members express intense emotions. We suggest using the dictionary, not vulgarity. You'll appear smarter!
2. Spamming - Simply forbidden. Spam and you're gone.
3. Multiple postings of the same message (flooding.) Do not post the same message in multiple forums without prior permission. This could be considered spamming or solicitation. Specifically those messages that contain links or recommendations of products or services that are for sale. It's acceptable to discuss products and services, but multiple postings relating to those products/services acting as advertisements will fall under our spam policy.
4. "Flaming" of other members is strictly forbidden. It's okay to express your opinion, but express it in a civil manner.

Please dont spam, and insult people, and then post asking other people not to bicker. Who weren't even bickering..

Thanks...

Regards..

motron,
i started this thread not to humilate or ridicule people, i created this just to express my tots of same person winning the tournaments and also i want to clear things up i am not also accusing them of cheating now that they talk and explain their side i rest my case and to emily roberts sorry if i had hurt your feelings i didnt mean to do that to you if someone is really cheating i guess the admins will find it out those players. the fact that emily roberts and lele77 come up to open and explain their side it shows that they are not really cheating so to those players who are accused of cheating and remain in silence may be they are the guilty ones.

In my view, there cannot be any doubt that what Emily Roberts is doing is not in the spirit of the tourneys.
The whole purpose of holding tournaments in Quick Start is that the gamer has no control over the races or the length of the races that they are involved in for the tournaments, so that everyone is on a level playing field, subject to their jockey skills and a certain amount of luck--not unsimilar to racing in real life. It is obvious that this ploy circumvents this intention. It does also explain Emily's ability to get a higher average pps in shorter races than longer races.
Whilst i cannot, not commend Emily on her initiative in doing this, as has been said in previous posts, it should be very easy for HRV to adjust the actual start of the tourney to when you press quick start, rather than to when you start the race.
All gamers want is a level playing field. The trouble is when people are consistently thrashed on pps, they feel they are either not playing right or that they are not good enough. This merely disincentives people---especially new gamers--and the ultimate losers are us all, as users stop playing tourneys, others stop creating tourneys and the site gets a bad reputation!
I beseach all enthusiatic gamers here to realise you are in community and that that community thrives or falls on the individuals in that community! No system is perfect, especially in the relative early days--i recall being able to circumvent yahoo's backgammon die about 8-9 years ago, so that you knew all the dice throws that were going to be rolled in a game! By helping HRV perfect the system, it is you and i who will gain, no one else. By trying to circumvent their system, it is you and i who will lose.

VERY SIMPLE REALLY

Need I say more. Thank you for a well-tuned reply to what is happening.

Russell

I wish for once , that you can play a online game without others playing you....One day maybe , everyone will play without having to set up a long shot sure bet before the race....its not cheating but its a scheme, a set up, so it is kinda like cheating in a way....because in this game , there are I know for a fact sure bet long shots...so I guess whoever figures out the best scheme are the ones going to win, not the ones who just hit quick start when the tourney starts Like I do....

Hi All - A few comments to your replies.

Tan -
======
I, like you, have been playing on-line games for many years. Bought my first 'puter in 1978 and was on-line way back when folks called it the "world-wide-web", the term "internet" hadn't been coined yet. LOL The arguement you present regarding exploiting is probably that old also. I have heard it many-many times, in many games. "Hey!, I am just doing what the game allows me to do". Try as they might, the developers are not perfect. The dilema then becomes, what is possible versus what was intended.

Does being a VIP give you an advantage over non-VIP's? Of course it does, WITHIN the INTENDED design of the game. The developers are, after all, trying to make some money from this game. So, I don't view that as an exploit. An exploit in my mind, is something that was NOT intended to be a part of the game design and is used to subvert the "spirit of the game" and obtain an advantage over other players.

Obviously, you and I are of opposing points of view on this. =) I did not call Emily a cheater and agree with your comments regarding "True" cheating. However, the unchecked use of exploits has been the downfall of many a on-line game.

Russel -
======

said - " Those that win all the time are probably playing within the game's intended parameters. When the gamer starts feeling like fodder for the top guns, then it ceases being fun."

Very true, I have seen many games lose standing and dissappear due to the minority dominating the entire game. Either through cheats, exploits or even in some cases, just by superior play of a small group of elite players that control and dominate the entire game.

I don't begrudge all the hard work and effort it took the top players to get to where they are, if they have done so honestly and within the spirit of the game. However, if they are allowed to dominate all areas and tourneys, then the "lesser mortals" will tire of the game and leave.

It's really a simple matter of economics. Lesser players equals less money for the developers. At some point the game becomes unprofitable and ceases to exsist. Seen it happen several times. As I am sure many of us have.

Reggae -
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Just wanted to add i agree with your post and comments which pretty much echo my thoughts and feelings.

(gah! wall of text here, lol as you can tell I don't have many strong feelings abiut this. ) =)

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♪♪ Bad Boyz - Bad Boyz, What'cha going to do?
What'cha going to do when they come for you ♪♪

Hey,guys
sorry if i offended anybody.Just talking some smack
Thanks for the info tanitha.Didnt know the rules(sorry)

Your right.Noyhing wrong with talking about oppertunities

See you all on the track :)